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NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

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NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby KlausNW » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:23 pm

Seaplane Landings Draw Rebuke


https://alamedasun.com/news/seaplane-la ... raw-rebuke

Richard Bangert Tuesday, February 20, 2018
The tour operator of a seaplane who landed at Alameda Point found himself in hot water with the city recently. A 1992 Piper single-engine seaplane landed and took off twice in the harbor near the USS Hornet Museum on Saturday, Feb. 3. The plane’s identification was reported to the city by the Alameda Point Harbor Seal Monitors. The group had photographed the same plane in October after it landed near the harbor seal float.

On Feb. 14, the City of Alameda sent a cease-and-desist letter and notice of trespass to Saul Singer, who operates Sea Plane Adventures of Mill Valley.

“Your aircraft was observed flying below the minimum safe altitude, touching down and taking off in and around Alameda Point,” Alan M. Cohen, Chief Litigation Counsel for the city, wrote to Singer. “Your activity endangers the health and safety of both people and wildlife … and violates the deed restrictions imposed by the United States Navy when the property was conveyed to the city.”

Just 40 minutes prior to the plane touching down at 10:24 a.m. on Feb. 3, about 20 outrigger canoes shoved off from Breakwater Beach and passed directly through the soon-to-be landing path of the plane. Kayakers were also beginning to shove off just as the plane approached over the bay from the west, banked and came over the rock wall and beach for a landing,

During summer and fall, it is common to see flocks of 50 or more California brown pelicans, a bird ill-equipped to suddenly avoid a plane strike, moving about en masse in the harbor diving for fish.

The Navy once used the harbor for recreational purposes, which included boat docks and a nearby campground. The Water Emergency Transportation Authority is building its Central Bay Operations and Maintenance Facility ferry not far from the harbor. Navy seaplanes stationed at the Naval Air Station took off and landed in the nearby ship channel until the squadron was decommissioned in 1958.

A video of the plane landing and taking off is posted on the harbor seal monitors’ Facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/alamedaseals1
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby KlausNW » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:33 pm

Jason, does this article show aviation's "Black Eye"?

At this point, is there anyway to improve aviation's image? Just think how well received these mystical UBER drones are going to be.

Maybe a fleet of low flying Icon5s will help our P.R.?
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby jjbaker » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:12 pm

Hmmm. My prediction was off by two weeks.

After the last episode of getting in trouble, I predicted that they would be back on the news by the beginning of February.

Maybe its a self-induced black eye?

Simple question: Is the water legal to use or is it off limits to seaplanes? If its listed as legal to use, then the city won't agree and litigate.

BTW: The entire show went down on Facebook.
Video, N Number Search and reporting. That Facebook thing is really SPA's playground and so is advocating for its members.

Since no ICON A5 was involved or observed on the video, I will assume none was there.

Me thinks Walter Windus is still the FD up there. Maybe one of you guys wants to write him. It won't be me, this time. :o
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby RKittine » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:22 pm

Our fraternity can be its own worst enemy.
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby jjbaker » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:40 pm

Shared it on Seaplanemagazine.com Facebook.

https://facebook.com/seaplanemagazine
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby KlausNW » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:23 pm

I might have been misunderstood. The Supercub has done nothing wrong in my opinion. I wanted to point out that the people have NO respect for aviation.

Californians are kinda known to be NIMBYs. It's the idea that Kayakers have full rights to use all waterways however they see fit and the rest of us stay out. Just the same old story another day.

Who knows why aviation is getting such a bad image, people are just getting more angry and offended over everything. It's probably a bigger problem then just a couple low flying aircraft.
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby RKittine » Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:04 am

I know locally Kayakers are probably looked on much better than aircraft as there is less noise, no fuel spills, no use of carbon based fuel etc. I know of very few Non-Flyers that support general aviation and only think of commercial aviation as a necessary form of travel. I know that locals support my sailboat much more than my power boat for similar reasons. There used to be two seaplanes on the lake at Warwick Airport. Both were owned by people who had houses on the lake. The lake is small and no gas powered engines are allowed on the few small boats that fish on the lake. When the two seaplane owners sold their homes and left, the lake converted to Special Permission for occasional use. Marty, one of the guys from Kline Kill Airport, that Glenn and I know, used to fly his Cub to Warwick at the beginning of every season to get the floats put on and then flew it out. That no longer happens because pressure from the remaining home owners, none of which are now flyers got the town, who owns the airport and lake to make seaplane operations illegal. I am waiting for that to happen on the New York side of Greenwood Lake. New Jersey outlawed seaplanes on their end of the lake years ago. The two planes that are on the Jersey side have Boat Registration Stickers on them and taxi to the New York end to take off and land on return. This of course gives us a taste of what it is to be a minority that is discriminated against.

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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby jjbaker » Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:50 pm

Bob,

what if any involvement in these foreseen advocacy issues does SPA have? I've recently heard funky reports of them now even presenting themselves as "advocacy experts" in France.

I know some desperate recruiting is going on, trying to make people join up as "European Field Directors"... besides quickly contacting flight schools covered on Seaplanemagazine.com for the Flight Training Directory...

I guess word got around that there are really many more seaplane pilots than a US centered view allowed to see...so the newfound international outreach is, lets say, noticed.

We're in pretty good shape over here, with some pretty smart and capable people...
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby RKittine » Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:16 pm

I do not think there is any real effort of the part of SPA as I can see it here, but I am not that close to the grass roots part of the seaplane fraternity. Glenn can answer better.
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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby jjbaker » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:23 am

Who knows why aviation is getting such a bad image, people are just getting more angry and offended over everything. It's probably a bigger problem then just a couple low flying aircraft.


How are they supposed to have respect for aviation if aviation has no respect for them?

Please go on a little history & facts trip with me on this issue...

Imagine how far it has gone before local residents reach out to an damn aviation news site, looking for help with a particular problem. How much better would it have been to pick up the ball, seek to communicate respectfully and like adults to find solutions. Mediate! Find common ground. Build rapport. I contacted SPA - warning of the upcoming issues - recommending a proactive approach to mitigate on the flaring ego issues. Ignored. Same from Singer. In the hearing, they handed the town their ass on a silver plate, smiled and walked out. Out of a litany of people contacted, the one guy to even care to respond to any email they sent is 5.529,3 miles away!

People who approached Singer were told they should piss off, as he had work to do so that he could send his kids off to ivy league school. All this in a state where nanny government solves every single problem and local zealots rule the game. Of course a more sympathetic response would have been possible, maybe (just maybe) causing different reactions.

But we can't talk to those we perceive as "them" and call the "pleasure police", "snowflakes", "libtards" and "cronies". Did anyone really expect the city to sit down and shut up? Of course they will now look and find ways to go after him. Its not like he's employing a couple hundred people - and heck - tax revenue in the area is just fine.

I am absolutely convinced that the current way of presenting ourselves is counterproductive to any future we may hope for. We're dealing with a populace that often can't tell the difference between a Piper Cub and a Boeing 747-8 - to them its all the same.

Who could blame them for it?

People are too busy with low level Trump Twitter vs. Liberal Obstructionist propaganda entertainment, setting up the next war, burying children who just wanted to go to school, paying taxes and working multiple jobs to stop and ask questions about little airplanes or try to make friends with the people who fly them...

So they revert to their local news rag for daily information and find "aviation experts" who shit on their own industry.

Here's an example of how a black eye can be punched repeatedly. Here is where paranoia and fear are bread.

Shit like this goes straight to the brain. People remember it!





We seem addicted to continue to do what we have always done, expecting vastly different results.

A whole industry was displayed in a terrible way and SPA, AOPA, EAA, NBAA, RAF, heck, every news outlet under the sun should have bombarded them to make sure the local news rags don't ever have to revert to peeps like Captain Zoom, for expert accident analysis. Its bad choo choo!

Bob is right - our fraternity is its own worst enemy.

Don't take my word for it, I really have no clue what I am talking about!

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Re: NIMBY Report - Alameda, CA.

Unread postby RKittine » Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:24 am

We seem to be doing the same thing in the Gun Ownership corner. We need to proactively help find solutions to issues that are relevant and especially were we are the minority, like aviation and more and more gun ownership. The same problem with the alphabet gun groups, where the only solution offered is to have more people carry more guns. I own a lot of guns but am not looking for this country to revert to being the wild west. I also do not want to see general aviation basically done away with in favor or a move to all commercial operators.

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